Dealer Stacking Pot Chips

[Buddymax]

I run a regular No Limit TH charity tournament with volunteer dealers.  I also run several home tournaments where some of the players are volunteer dealers in the charity tournament.  Dealers in the charity tournament are not players in the charity tournament.

Situation.  In the Charity Tournament the dealer stacked the pot chips based on denomination.  We do this sometimes in the home tournament as some games are pot limit and it makes it easier to calculate pot bets.  Some players carry this habit over to no limit games to make the table neater and to always know what is in the pot in case someone "splashes the pot" with their bet.

At the charity tournament one of the dealers was told by a player they were not allowed to stack the chips.  The dealer said there was no rule against it and it was dealer prerogative.  This was not brought to my attention until several days later when the "dealer" came to play in the home tournament and told me of this player concern.

Question.  Is the dealer in any tournament forbidden to stack the chips during the play of any hand, unless it is specifically to calculate the value of a pot limit bet?

I could not find an answer in the TDA rules.

[BillM16]

Question.  Is the dealer in any tournament forbidden to stack the chips during the play of any hand, unless it is specifically to calculate the value of a pot limit bet?

I could not find an answer in the TDA rules.

TDA 2017 Rule #54-A:
Players are entitled to a pot count in pot-limit only. Dealers will not count the pot in limit and no-limit.

That said, some may argue that there is a difference between stacking and counting.  Traditionally, the pot has not been stacked or counted in limit and no-limit. I believe it has been discouraged given that some experienced players believe that it would wrongly encourage wise action or discourage unwise action from the "less informed" players.  Also, counting the pot takes time and slows the game down. Of course, knowing the size of a legal bet is necessary and therefore counting the pot is allowed in pot-limit games.  In limit and no-limit, players will often ask the dealer to spread the chips in the pot so that they can count or estimate the pot themselves.  However, even in those cases, the dealer should not attempt to do it perfectly. 

[Nick C]

Having trained dealers for many years, I would never allow dealers to stack or separate chips unless the game being played is a Hi-Lo Split game. In that case, I would encourage stacking chips. The dealer procedure should be carried out in a specific fashion that would not slow down the game.

I remember an occasion while training student dealers for an Omaha Hi-Lo Split game. The dealer decided not to stack the cheques because the flop contained three picture cards. Obviously, there was no possibility for a low hand. I told the dealer to stack the cheques anyway. The debate as to why began? The dealer said: "why would I waste my time stacking and separating chips when no low is possible? I said: "during our training, I want all students to get in the habit of separating and stacking cheques whenever dealing a Hi-Lo Split game"...the other reason is, I felt it was not up to the dealer to let the players know that there was no chance for a low hand. The reasons are obvious.
The dealer reluctantly proceeded to burn and turn, the turn and river. In the end, two players had high straights and the pot was split anyway!

To get back to the original question: No...dealers should not stack cheques or chips in any pot unless it is a Hi-Lo Split game.

[Max D]

I agree with both comment and would add, and it is probably not a good reason, that we have discussed distracted players (i.e. on their phones, headsets, talking to another table, etc.) and there is no reason to help them if they do not pay attention.  Player should protect their cards, pay attention to the action, and know approximately what is in the pot to make informed decisions .

[WSOPMcGee]

At the WSOP dealers are not to stack chips in any game format except for split pot games where they may begin to stack the pot ONLY after the river card has been dealt.


Being that you have volunteer dealers and are not running professional tournaments, charity or otherwise, I would allow if not encourage the stacking of chips for ease of play and customer accommodation to aid in gameplay.