Heads up Action out of turn, specifically "Checking"

[Uniden32]

Curious as to how some of the other tournament personell handle this.

Heads up in a tournament.

Action on P1, P2 checks out of turn.
P1 then bets.

Do you allow P2 to raise or does passive action (check) only allow him to call/fold ?

Thanks in advance,

Ralph

[Unregistered84]

According to TDA rules, in this case rule 38, P2 has all options open (fold, call or raise). Even so, any player acting out of turn can still be subject to penalty, depending on the specific situation.

[Tristan]

I would allow P2 all actions.  If it becomes a recurring problem, I would penalize.

[Uniden32]

According to TDA rules, in this case rule 38, P2 has all options open (fold, call or raise). Even so, any player acting out of turn can still be subject to penalty, depending on the specific situation.

I was aware of the actual TDA verbage, hence the post in Non-TDA rules discussion.

There are some tournament directors who only allow a passive action after a passive out of turn action in a heads up situation, and I simply wanted to know how others felt.

Thanks again.

[K-Lo]

Hi Uniden:

I am in the camp that would have preferred, in theory, to limit the out-of-turn checker to only passive responses.  However, I do sympathize that a one-size-fits-all rule (with an appropriate penalty applied depending on how 'bad' the angle was) is probably easier to enforce, and may produce more consistent results.

You might find this prior discussion interesting:  http://www.pokertda.com/forum/index.php?topic=988.0

K-Lo

[MikeB]

Hi Uniden:

I am in the camp that would have preferred, in theory, to limit the out-of-turn checker to only passive responses.  However, I do sympathize that a one-size-fits-all rule (with an appropriate penalty applied depending on how 'bad' the angle was) is probably easier to enforce, and may produce more consistent results.

You might find this prior discussion interesting:  http://www.pokertda.com/forum/index.php?topic=988.0

K-Lo

Definitely think this one is well worth reviewing at TDA Summit 2015.

[Nick C]

Uniden32,

This has always been a debatable subject, glad you brought it back to the table. I've never been in favor of allowing any out of turn player (when head to head), a chance to raise, or retract their OOT action. Considering your situation with a little twist: Player B checks and Player A also checks...do you allow Player B to now change his check to a bet? Of course not. To me, it's the same situation. I am in favor of the OOT Player being held to his action. The OOT is the guilty party, not the skipped player.

[Brian Vickers]

I'm in favor of OOT action when heads up to be automatically binding AND subject to penalty. No forcing first player to arbitrarily "check" so that it's binding.
Player B OOT bets, Player A says "I call." We shouldn't sit there and say "wait, you have to check first, then you can call."  Let's just get on with the hand.